How do you changes jobs in midlife?
Hey there Beautiful,
I’ve noticed one thing that this pandemic has done to women.
It’s made them really think about their lives and what’s important to them.
Many women have begun to rethink their current jobs and say, “Is this really what I want to do?”
If you’re in that situation, lucky for you I found someone who can help you answer that question. Amber Beam is today’s guest on the podcast and she gives WONDERFUL advice on helping you through your career awakening.
And even if you are just starting out to return to the workforce, Amber’s tips will help you as well.
What you will learn in this episode:
- Why job hopping no longer has the stigma it once did.
- How to pitch a career move internally at your current job.
- How to repackage your skills for a new job.
- The new types of questions being asked during interviews.
- Her STAR method for answering interview questions.
So who is Amber Beam?
Amber Beam is a midlife career coach for women who want to switch careers without starting over or taking a pay cut.
With 15 years of experience as an I-O Psychologist in HR, her goal is to show women over 40 exactly how to cash-in on decades of experience and expertise to launch their soul-mate career.
Amber specializing in translating your superpowers into marketable skills to score five-figure raises and “Summer Fridays” year-round. Her proven coaching system teaches you how to reach the height of your professional potential by silencing the mind drama and shifting your mindset to craft a happy, rewarding, and successful career that makes a difference and pays the bills.
Amber lives and works in Washington, DC. When not connecting women to energizing and exciting work, she loves spoiling her niece and nephew, gawking at masterpieces in the Smithsonian, and sipping fruity-umbrella drinks on the beach.
She often daydreams of casually biking through the lavender fields of Provence sporting a wicker basket filled with baguettes, cheese, and wine. Sigh.
And if you want to know more about Amber, all the ways you can contact her are below.
I’ll talk to you later, Beautiful!
Links mentioned in this episode and to contact Amber:
Alice Agnello: Hey, Amber, thanks so much for being with me today. I appreciate it.
Amber Beam: Thank you. I'm excited to chat.
Alice Agnello: I know. We got to talking when we did our little pre-interview, and Amber and I just clicked, I think, immediately. So, hopefully this interview is going to show that and we won't over talk to each other too much.
Amber Beam: There's definitely going to be giggles.
Alice Agnello: Yes.
Amber Beam: And, oh yeah's.
Alice Agnello: Exactly. So, Amber tell my listeners who you are and what you do.
Amber Beam: My name is Amber Beam and I am a mid-life career coach for women who want to switch careers without starting over or taking a pay cut.
Alice Agnello: I love all that you just said. Cause I feel like the pandemic has just opened the door for really everyone. But especially what I've seen in our demographic is a lot of women are rethinking even with the kids, you know, being out of the house. And you know, we're recording this in September and kids are going back to school. So, women are starting to really think about, 'well, do I want to keep doing what I'm doing? Do I want to start something new?' Or, as we've talked about like repackage, what I have into something else. And I think the pandemic really brought that to the forefront and made people start thinking differently. What do you think Amber?
Amber Beam: Absolutely. I think for the most part, the clients that I'm seeing most recently, it's a career awakening. They're having these 'aha' moments around, I thought I could do this until I retired because it pays the bills, I know how to do it so well, it's not a big lift for me or I've done it for so long and I love my coworkers. Or, if you're one of the lucky few who loves their boss. Like, there are all those kinds of deep ties and I think one of the quotes that I saw was like, disruption gives you the momentum for change, don't waste it. And I was like, 'Oh, that's so good.' I think people are really feeling it right now, there's this, 'okay, status quo isn't as great as I thought it was.' So, what does that mean? And I think the first step people kind of take a deep breath and a gulp and then say, 'well, where do I start? What do I do first? Can I do this?'.
Alice Agnello: I guess, as you said, especially if your at a job that you think is, it's okay because the coworkers and the boss are great. So, it really makes you want to stay because, for me, I feel like I would be letting them down.
Amber Beam: Yes.
Alice Agnello: That I somehow owe them something to stay longer and continue with what I'm doing. But I also know that if that still continues and let's say you do that for another year and you still have that inkling of this is not exactly what I wanted to do, or I think I should be doing, you really are going to be slightly unhappy and you might, again, love the job because of your coworkers and your boss, but you're really not going to enjoy fully what you're doing and get up out of bed to really enjoy the day. So, as you said, kind of like now that you've come to this 'aha' moment of, okay, now I think, I even just think or want to start thinking about doing something new, kind of like, where should I go or what should I do? Or how should I think about this?
Amber Beam: Yes, and I've actually created a roadmap for this process because I know it's so overwhelming and there are so many places you can start. And what I love to do with clients is start in the place that is most fulfilling and that is talking about their strengths and understanding what you do well. And as my mentor, Jenny Blake says, 'doubling down.' Like, let's not try to fix our weaknesses and instead, really lean into the things that we do so well. And I think for most women, we don't even recognize what those are because they're easy and we just assume everybody can do it right. But it comes so natural and it's a great way to kind of have a warm, fuzzy, because you get to feel all the good things that you do well, and it sets you up to see opportunity in different ways that you could use those same strengths in a different role or even in a different field.
Alice Agnello: It's one of those questions that I've always really, did not account to say, I hated those questions. When they say, what's your best strength or your greatest strength and what's your worst strength. And then you had to answer that question, okay, this is a worst strength or a horrible strength, but I have to somehow make it and spin it a positive.
Amber Beam: Yes.
Alice Agnello: And so I always hated those questions. And as to what you're saying, your weaknesses always feel like are going to be your weaknesses. You can learn to how to get them to be better, or you can tolerate them, but you're never really going to enjoy them. And as you said, your strengths light you up. They're easy. You just do it without thinking. And as you said, because they're so easy, you think I can't get paid for that because it just comes naturally. Like why would someone want to pay me for something that I do so easily? And what do you find women struggle with when trying to find their strengths? Is it like, they just don't see it? Or I've got other outside influences who've always told me that strength actually is a weakness or it's bad for me.
Amber Beam: I think most people in Gen-X or late boomers are really caught up in the job title or the job role. And there are all these job duties that you've been told you're responsible for and this is what makes the job. But, what makes the person exceptional? What makes you a fantastic producer in that role is actually the things outside of the job duties. And sometimes those are the hardest to see, that's why I recommend definitely using an assessment. I prefer the StrengthsFinders assessment from the Gallup group. It's affordable. It's quick, you get really great results, and I love they have this super detailed, I think they call it the insights report. It's almost eerie when you read it. Cause you're like, 'Oh, I do that.' And you don't realize, but a machine can tell you these things that you can't see about yourself. And it's a really like I said, a very affordable investment to have these 'aha' moments and then it just jump-starts your next steps into, 'Oh, well, if this is what I'm so good at I can do this anywhere.' And just having that moment really sets you on fire and gives you the motivation to think, 'I can do this.' I love my boss. I love my coworkers, but I can do something else.
Alice Agnello: I love that you brought up StrengthsFinders because I did it three years ago and it was spot on me, to the T, shockingly scary. And for me, what helped me greatly is because my number one is strategic and there is something, like my brain works differently, but I couldn't figure out why other people wouldn't think the way that I did. And when StrengthsFinder actually put a word to what I do and what I do well, I just had to sit there for a while and I'm like, 'Oh, that is why my brain works the way it does.'
Amber Beam: Yes.
Alice Agnello: That's what I can take. I can take info and figure it out so much faster. I give solutions faster than other people. And I also learned that that's also why I have to explain things to people, meaning that I have, I have to slow down and explain people why, how I got from A to B to C and this is, and C is really the good solution, not D or E or F that you're thinking.
Alice Agnello: So, I highly encourage anyone to go and take it. As you said, it's very affordable and they do a really good job of explaining things. And I've seen their podcast was also helpful in going and drilling into each of your strengths and explaining how that strength can be applied to your job or to your home life. Was again, it was eyeopening for me as well. And so once you've kind of gone through and figured out your strengths, I feel like women really downplay what they've done for the past, let's say, 20 years and also they might be afraid to ways you've been doing something for 10 years, therefore you're very comfortable with it, and I can't think of another opportunity for me to do. Or, I've jumped, you know, three years, three years, three years. So, I've got lots of different experience. So, let's take the woman, whose kind of been the same thing for the past, like 10 years. How does she kind of make that mental pivot to maybe even opening the door to another possibility?
Amber Beam: I think the first thing to think about is what are you interested in and really take a look at your motivations and your values. That gives you a nice positioning in terms of if I'm making the leap out of my current company, these are the things that I want to make sure I'm jumping into. These are important to me. They're going to make sure that my satisfaction stays high for longer. The grass is greener happens when you don't take the time to really go back and really nail down your motivations and your values and seek those out as part of your job search process.
Alice Agnello: Because now you've got experience in the sense that when you're in your twenties, you kind of just say, yes, I'll do that. Yes, I'll do that.
Amber Beam: Yes.
Alice Agnello: Yes, I'll do that because, A, you're trying to figure yourself out, but also because you're desperate for a job and you just want to work. And now I feel like with the maturity comes with that great wisdom of, I'm not going to put up with a boss who does this. If my coworkers act this way, I'm not going to do this. And so you have to kind of take that leap in the sense that I know what I want, and I'm going to try and find it. And I might not get it with the first job, but keep persisting. Cause it will, you'll finally find it in that connection. And so for a woman who's been kind of done little things around, but knows or something better. How does she kind of take all that knowledge and move forward with that too?
Amber Beam: I think the person who's had multiple opportunities in the last decade could really sit back and say, what's the common thread here? Each time I was ready for a new opportunity. What was kind of that catalyst moment? What was the thing that was kind of poking me in the side saying, you know, it's time, you know, it's time to move on. Think about that kind of moment and then also think about what might have kept you there a little longer. So, the thing that was holding you back, or the thing that really kept you grounded, because those things are equally important. And if you can take the time to identify what they were, you can really pivot into a position that nicely fits what you're looking for, fora little longer term, because at this stage, some of your listeners might be at the point where they're five years away from retirement.
Amber Beam: So, they'd really like this last hop to be the last hop, right? If you're in a position where you have longer to do that, I would say job hopping the entire negative stigma around that has fallen away. So, do not hesitate if you see an opportunity where you could expand your skills, especially right now, like I said, with disruption, everything is up for grabs. Everything is up for this moment of, 'Oh yeah, we could do that. Or we could do that differently.' And I would say, especially thinking about if you're one of those people who loves your company, this is a great time to pivot internally because management and leadership is desperate to find top talent. They want to find the best and brightest. And you already understand the culture. You understand the players, the stakeholders, how things work. That gives you a leg up on anybody they would hire outside. And if you have a good relationship with your boss, there's this opportunity to say, 'Hey, I see an opportunity there, there's a project that interests me. Is that something I could pursue?'
Alice Agnello: And the thing is, is that women have been conditioned not to ask for what they want.
Amber Beam: Absolutely.
Alice Agnello: And so that is one of the key things I always think is that don't expect your boss or another department head or a friend in another department think that they know what you want. They think you're probably happy where you are in the current situation in your department because you've expressed, I like it here. It's fabulous. It's wonderful. So, if that's all they hear from you, they're not going to think about you and advancing you and other opportunities, unless you communicate with them saying, 'Hey, you know what, I loved what I'm doing, but I would really like to learn about this or expand my horizons, this, or even take a class that maybe your boss and the company might be able to pay for you.' So, you can even expand your knowledge even more.
Amber Beam: Absolutely. And I think this is the time again, where you can say, I think this is interesting and as you understand your skills better, you can do a little, a little practice run at your repackaging. So, because I have worked on this project and this project, I have solid skills in project management and budget analysis and putting together the presentation and briefing for executive leaders. All of those things I'm really strong in, and I understand, and I see over in the marketing department. It looks like they could probably use some help with those skills on the so-and-so project. I'm really interested in helping out. Do you think I could have a couple hours a week to see if that's a good fit? If there's something that I could do to add value. Be sure to pitch this conversation as something that benefits your organization, the company at large and if you take a step back and find the win for your boss, it'll go even further. So, being able to say, I know that you support cross-functional training, or I know that it's in your goals for the year to do more peer-to-peer networking. I thought this might be a great opportunity for us to set something up. Think of the win for them too.
Alice Agnello: No, that's all wonderful advice. Because again, if you come at them with what's in it, just for me, they're most likely not going to listen to what you're saying, because all I heard was how this benefiting you. But if you can make your boss shine in some way, I'm sure that they're going to be on board with that. And so if I am currently in a job that it's fine, like it's just, okay, but I'm really interested in pivoting and either going into doing something myself or in a totally different career path, what would be some ideas that would help her out in that regard?
Amber Beam: I think the very first step is to write it down, to prove to yourself that you're that interested, that you'll make a list. And then the next step is to hop on LinkedIn. You can ask people that you are already connected to for an informational interview. It's basically a 20 minute chitchat session about them. It's all about their role, how they got there, what they love to do about it and maybe that closing question. Cause I think in 20 minutes you can probably get three questions in the closing question would be something like, what do you think are the most important skills for someone moving into this position? And then you've done two things. You've let them know you're interested and you've converted them to an ambassador because now their ear's to the ground. And they're listening for opportunities for you because you've expressed interest.
Alice Agnello: No, I love that advice, especially doing the informational interview, because then they know when you ask that question about skills, you can either then, okay, I need to get better at that certain skill and with so much online now, you can definitely find a way to develop that skill if something is lacking and then you can stay in your current job, not be panicked, but know that you're working towards something else. I've done that a lot of times when there's been a job where I'm okay with it, it's fine but I know it's time. I need to do something different. And so, you have to change your mindset into not, I hate this job and it sucks and I don't want to go.
Amber Beam: Totally.
Alice Agnello: Yeah, exactly. I am going because this is providing me the stepping stone to something else, you know? Once you do that shift, it's so much easier to go to work cause you know that I have a plan. I am working on something else and everything else just, it just makes it so much easier to deal with the boss that's not fabulous, or the coworkers that just, Oh, take up too much of your time or they just won't go away when you're trying to do work or something like that.
Amber Beam: Absolutely. Yeah. I think for a lot of job search and career change in general, the biggest part is mindset. And having that positive perspective of this is the place that I am in for the moment. And also once you kind of take off the, I'm an employee goggles, you start to see, Oh, I could networking with these people right now using my internal knowledge to get a little more information, kind of, you know, offline on the downlow. Nobody has to know too much, but also building bridges through them, very authentically creating these pathways and opportunities for what's next, because you might not know and you might be introduced to something surprisingly right in your own company. Like you, you have no idea. This thing even exists and suddenly, just by having conversations with people, you're made aware of an opportunity that's right there for you.
Alice Agnello: No, exactly. That's wonderful advice. Especially getting to know the other people. Like you have a lot of people in your network, but you don't talk to them in that way. It's just, 'Hey, how are you? Let's go get lunch or how's the kids, and you know, and how's your husband,' or, something like that. But, you're not actually talking about, 'Hey, I'm thinking about, I'm getting interested in this.' And then all of a sudden you can tell that their lights up, or I have a friend who. And it just starts that ripple effect that makes you think, okay, I can do this. That was easy. Just to have a quick conversation with my friend and what else do you see women doing now when they are thinking about a career repackaging and re-inventing themselves? Like what else do you feel that they struggle with during that time period?
Amber Beam: I think it's hard again for people to break out of the job duties, mindset. If you can sit back and think of your skills, like a set of Legos and suddenly you have a red block and a yellow block and a blue block, instead of I am a project manager. Therefore, I manage projects. That's too narrow. But if you can sit back and say, well, I do risk assessments. Well, suddenly your pathways become open to anything in finance, anything in tech, all of those industries are heavily dependent on risk management. You might also think, Oh, I have really great skills at getting consensus. These power skills. We used to call them soft skills. I am just denying that ever existed and totally leaning into we are calling these power skills, all of the interpersonal, the emotional intelligence, the things that really differentiate top performers are power skills.
Amber Beam: Think about those. When I see someone enacting this same skill in a powerful way, and I see them bringing their best to this role, what are they doing? It may be a department way off from where you've been before. Suddenly, you're looking at maybe acquisitions or contracts or something that you had never even thought of, but that skill is super important for somebody who has to bring together the deal. And that's a good way to kind of think about, okay, if I'm repackaging, what I can do, I'm not this job anymore. I am all of these skills. And suddenly you're, the Lego plane set that you bought is now a boat. And you can be in the ocean instead of flying through the clouds. Like there's this ability to really repackage what it is that you can do. And that narrative is even stronger for mid-career because your experience is so deep.
Amber Beam: I find that a lot of people have, and it's not misplaced, but it is often a bigger fear than it seems at first, the fear that millennials or the new Gen-Z could do their job and get paid less. So, why would they keep me? And I don't think that that's it. It's not irrational. I'm not going to fib on you. It's not a rational, but I will say the way that you fight fire with fire is that your depth of experience brings all kinds of things a new grad or a junior employee does not have. And they can't because they don't have the experience.
Alice Agnello: Especially just knowing how to read a room, to know which person should I go talk to about this before I go bring it to this other person. Who's buy-in do I need to have, before I go in front of this change-maker in order to get this to happen? You know, they just don't have that experience yet. And what's funny is when you were talking about the power skills and I was thinking that, so one of my top five is positivity. So, that's number four, obviously it's there.
Alice Agnello: And so I remember two different jobs, two different bosses, both in different situations would come up to me and say, 'Oh, well, you know, you're not very happy today. So, that really affects everybody.' And I just had the one in thinking of, I just looked at my thought, that's not my job. Like it's not my job to be Ms. Mary sunshine, like all the time. And then I took the StrengthsFinder and then I realized that that's one of my strengths, is that I'm able to bring a positive viewpoint, will outlook bring people together from common backgrounds, common themes, common differences and stuff, bring together, and work together on one thing.
Alice Agnello: But at the time, you know, I don't think that's a skill of mine. It's just who I am and it makes it easy and breezy, as they say for me to do. And it's not a one that I don't know if I could really communicate on a piece of paper, what that is, but I think it would shine through as I'm talking and being interviewed with the HR manager, with a manager that that would then come across. Another concern I think is that I haven't been doing interviews for a while. And the last one I did was five years ago. Is there anything that's changed? Have you seen in interviewing at all that might throw someone a loop if they go for a new job?
Amber Beam: I think there's a huge movement towards behaviorally based interview questions, which as an IO psychologist, that's part of something that I learned to write in grad school. So, I feel very passionately that that is the best way to find a good candidate, but for the job search, or sometimes they catch you off guard. They generally start with something like, 'tell me about a time when.' The idea is that they're trying to base your past performance to predict your future performance. So you kind of have to have these well-sculpted responses in advance. And this is something that I talk about in my career change bootcamp ad nauseum. Here are the top seven questions that you're likely to be asked, rehearse, rehearse, rehearse. And I'll tell you what I recommend is called the star method. So, S for situation, T for task, A for action, and R for result. Now, here's what normally happens. You get so excited about explaining the situation and what you were doing. You forget to talk about the result and that's the most important part. So, when you're practicing, start by writing the result first and that'll help trigger your brain. Oh yeah. This story is about that time. I increased sales by 31% in quarter three of 2019. Like be specific, give a number.
Alice Agnello: You hear that? Oh, I can tell a story. And then all of a sudden, now you get switched into that. Now I'm comfortable. And I can tell the story and I tell you the story, and then I'm done. And then you're like, yeah, what I know. So, I'm sorry I interrupted. Go ahead.
Amber Beam: No, yes. The idea is that you want to be careful about showing your results. And one way that I see our feminine nature takes hold is we talk about the Royal we. We want to share in the glory. We want to give to the team. And that is wonderful. Absolutely talk about the things that were accomplished by the team. But during these questions use I statements. I led the team. I directed team member, Amber, be sure to give specific instances of what you did, because as the person on the other side, who's jotting down notes and going to use a rating scale to give you a score. I don't know that you did any of those things. If you don't specifically call out your activities, the things that you were responsible for, and it's just too easy to fall into the we.
Alice Agnello: I'm so glad that you brought that up because I've caught myself, you know, doing that because I think women are taught not to toot their own horns, not to say how wonderful I am. And so sometimes I would do that. Like at previous jobs, I'd be like, 'Oh yeah, I did that pretty good, huh?' And then they would look at me and I'm just like, what I told you exactly. That was me. I did it. And I would be the first person though, to then give credit. It was myself. And so-and-so like, I never wanted to steal thunder from another person, especially, you know, another woman. But we just, we don't know how to toot our own horns to explain how important what we did to bring those sales in the third quarter up. Was an amazing thing for us to do.
Alice Agnello: And do you recommend going through and kind of getting some of those questions and so you kind of have some ideas of what they have and that we've got some stories already ready to go. And then do you feel like women should try, if they haven't done this in a while, even if they have, just start to kind of role play with someone else. I'm, like my husband I would not do it with cause he would drive me insane trying to give my important things. But you know, someone like you, a career coach or a good friend who could somehow listen to your answers and ask and kind of role play a little bit.
Amber Beam: Absolutely. And I would say there's no substitute for video. I know it will be cringe worthy to watch, but it gives you so much good feedback because you can see the things that you don't think you're being rated on, but you are. I have heard from many people, if I put on my HR hat, when you get back to the HR office, they say, 'Oh my, that candidate was so strong.' Everything we wanted on paper, but his energy was so low. So, when you record yourself on video, you can see your posture, you can see your delivery, you can hear yourself trailing off. If you're starting to ramble and you get to clock how long it takes you to tell one of these fabulous stories.
Alice Agnello: Oh, you're totally right.
Amber Beam: Yes. All of that feedback is huge. And like I said, in the beginning, it will be, cringe-worthy just bite down and take it. But there's amazing progress on the other side. And you will be so freaking confident when they call you for an interview, you'll take the first slot they offer because you won't need an extra day to prepare. Absolutely. Yes, please. I'll see you tomorrow morning at nine. Just be that confident because you will have rehearsed. You'll understand exactly what your beautiful story is saying. You'll have confidence in your delivery and there's no better way to really prepare for an interview than watching yourself on video.
Alice Agnello: Completely agree on all of that. And the only other two things I can think of is make sure you try on what you're wearing the night before. So, you don't panic the day of I've done that. That was a bad idea. And then, cause you don't want to sit there and fidget, like if the shirt is just a little too tight or a little too tight across your chest, you don't want to be fidgeting because then people are going to think you're a little odd. Cause you just keep moving and perfume. Oh my gosh. I don't know how many interviews I have gone in. And I walk in the room and I'm immediately hit with a ton of perfume and already I go, 'Oh Lord, this, how am I going to survive this interview?' Because that was way too much coming at me at one time. And there's some guys with cologne. Holy moley. because then what happens is when you go to talk to the people who are part of the interview process, you call people like, Oh the one with a lot of perfume. Oh the one with a lot of cologne. And you don't want to be that person with a lot of the cologne, at all. Amber is the other tip that you would want a woman who's thinking about repackaging her self at all?
Amber Beam: One thing that I would say is, think about this moment as an open door. That door may lead to what we've already talked about. Just the next step, or it may open a door to a new relationship or really bolstering your network. I think there's a lot of energy right now and we can harness that for something positive. Even if it's not an actual move to a new job, there are lots of steps in between. And just getting that momentum, just taking that first step, just believing in yourself that you can switch when you want. If you want tomorrow, 90 days from now, June, 2021, that's available to you and the door is opening now for you to take that first step.
Alice Agnello: Oh Amber, I've absolutely loved our discussion today. Two HR nerds kind of geeking out. I love it when we do that. So, how's the best way for an audience to get ahold of you. If they want to repackage and update or change the way that they are in the workplace.
Amber Beam: I have put some amazing resources on my website at amberbeam.com/results, because I know that's what you want to get. As I spoke about the roadmap that is there, I also have a job search tool there. Lots of things that can be your first step.
Alice Agnello: Awesome. Okay. So here's my fun three questions. I ask everyone at the end. Tell me something that not a lot of people know about you.
Amber Beam: I published a cookbook.
Alice Agnello: How cool is that? What kind of cookbook?
Amber Beam: It's called Weeknight Paleo and I still have 10 copies my closet. So, if that's the thing that elite listeners are interested in. Just reach out.
Alice Agnello: I love it, and name three things that you can't live without, other than your family and friends.
Amber Beam: Definitely chocolate, music, and sense of humor. I took a trip to New Zealand and I have a very dry sense of humor. And I kept noticing like my jokes are not landing. This is just so wild. I don't know who I am if people aren't like cracking up with me. So, you got to have a sense of humor.
Alice Agnello: I always love it when I, cause I usually can read a room and so when someone has a dry sense of humor, I just laugh because otherwise I think they can't really be that like mean or awkward. You know what I mean? Like we're not really sure if they're laughing or not. I just go, that's funny. And then what everyone else usually will join in. So, I like your sense of humor. So you're fine.
Amber Beam: Be the leader, yes.
Alice Agnello: If you could choose one song to play every time you entered a room for the rest of your life, what would it be?
Amber Beam: I'm going to go with Joe Crocker's version of, With a Little Help from my Friends.
Alice Agnello: I like that one. I like that one. Thank you again, Amber so much for being a part of the podcast today. I so appreciate our conversation.
Amber Beam: Absolute pleasure. Thank you so much.
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